Open Hearts, Hidden Truths
Open Hearts, Hidden Truths is a new podcast where the raw meets the revelatory – secrets, realizations, and turning points that reshape who we become, yet rarely get discussed.
First-time and never-again experiences, in particular, compel us to evolve.
Through personal confessions and guest stories, we explore provocative shifts and uncover the hidden truths that connect us.
Episodes released every other Tuesday.
Open Hearts, Hidden Truths
From the Cage to the Capitol: A January 6th Story
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Daniel Gray, a former MMA fighter, recounts his journey that led to a life-changing event on January 6th.
What pivotal moment reshaped your life's direction?
Enjoying the show? Leave a review!
Intro
Speaker 1This is Shamron, and you're listening to Open Hearts, Hidden Truths. Addiction. Homelessness. Prison. January 6. Daniel Gray is my guest who's joining me today. And he shares a number of pivotal moments that altered the trajectory of his life.
Coming to America
Speaker 2So I was uh I was born in Blackpool, England. And my mother is uh she's English, raised in Africa and Australia, and my dad is from McCallan, Texas on the border. And uh in England we were like a very churched family. We were part of uh a place called Living Street Ministries. We had an open door in our house. So there was always people in and out of the house. And I have two brothers, I have an older and a younger brother. And I had a sister born when I was about eight years old, and uh, she was born severely uh disabled because she's what they call a breach presentation, where she came out feet first, and that caused the umbilical cord to suffocate her. So she came out with some severe, like mentally handy like handicaps. And so we came to America when I was uh eight years old, and we moved from uh Birmingham, England to Irving, Texas, because my family wanted to see about getting a better standard of healthcare in America than in England. And so, you know, my my my first experience with America was I I love this place, you know. It's like, you know, you go to a you go to a gas station, they have 15 sodas versus what England had. You can get a big gulp that's like this big. I was just blown away. And so yeah, I loved it. I dropped my accent in like six months, my parents said. I was talking like I was Texan, you know, I really wanted to be an American. And um, you know, unfortunately, my sister, she had some difficulties and she ended up passing away at a young age. And so, you know, as is pretty common when that happens, my parents they separated. It was a very like volatile time in my life. I moved in with my dad. He was a software contractor, so he did a lot of traveling. So we went from uh Irving, Texas to Houston to Galveston to Atlanta, Georgia, to Jacksonville, Florida, where I am now. And uh at some point he moved on when I was 18, or sorry, when I was 17, I went back to England and I did my education. So I did two years of uh education over in England. I did my A levels, which is funny because I actually dropped out in ninth grade in America. And then I went to England and I did like a very competitive A level, and I actually did okay in that. And I came back to America. Uh, I was probably 20 years old, and I just started working in bars. And um, so about 25 years old, I uh decided that I wanted to do something with my life, and it wasn't education-based. I was like, I want to do something different, and I was always a big martial arts fan, so I started training in martial arts and I walked into a gym and I met uh my mentor, his name's Roberto, and I've been training with him for you know probably 20 odd years now. And I wanted to become a professional fighter, so I started taking amateur fights, I took a pro fight, uh, got my butt kicked pretty bad in that one, uh, but became friends with the guy that I fought. And he moved, he was actually from, well, he wasn't from Thailand, but he was living in Thailand and he came to America. We fought in America, and he went back to Asia and he was like, I you should move to Asia. And so uh I did it. You know, it was during the real estate crash. I owned a house that had lost all of its value.
Speaker 1In terms of time periods, this is around 08?
A Change Overseas
Speaker 2This would be right around, well, it would, I think 2010 is right when I left to go to Asia. But yeah, it's right around 2008, 2009. So I ended up moving to a place called Shinju, Taiwan. And I was actually living in Jubei and Xinju. And, you know, people don't know Taiwan's a small island off the coast of China. And the reason I went there was because a friend recommended it to me. Um, they're always hiring English teachers. So if you're Western, there's plenty of work over there, they'll pay you well. And there's a it's a small island, so there weren't a lot of martial artists there. And so I went over there just completely on a whim. I had one friend that I that I made contact with. I made contact with one other guy, and I just uh ended up selling all my stuff at the flea market with my ex-wife, and we flew to Asia and we moved in, and uh I ended up spending three years over there and I fought twice. I got I lost both those fights. I was never a great fighter. I was I was really good at losing. Um but I uh I went over there and I started working for a gentleman named Sung Ming Yan, and he owned a company called Tough MMA. And I came in as a as a jiu-jitsu instructor and I worked there for a little while. I helped him build out a really big fitness program that ended up being really successful. And you know, at some point there were some strains. It's it's hard living in a in a non-English speaking country. It's hard, you know, Taiwan is full of Taiwanese people. So if you're Western, you're gonna stick out. You're gonna, there's a lot of attention on you all the time. There's no real privacy. They don't really have a standard for privacy like we do in America. You know, they're they're kind of they kind of live on top of each other. And so it was very difficult on my uh my ex-wife, and it was it was hard on me too. And so we ended up coming back to America again. And um that was hard for me, you know, because I walked away. They offered me a gym in Taipei to run, and it just kind of felt like I was living this crazy dream. I'm overseas, I'm fighting, you know, and um I'm I'm being offered opportunities, and I kind of had to pack it up and come back. But coming back from Taiwan put a big strain on us. Uh, I think she really wanted a simple life. And I just have this thing in me where I just always had to be pulled towards the adrenaline for some reason. And so we're living in Jack's Beach, and I got a small place, it's right by the ocean. It's 530 bucks a month. I can see the ocean from my window. I'm running a martial arts program. I'm traveling with this rock festival as a bar manager too. So, you know, I look back and you know, I wrote about this a lot in prison, but I look back and I'm like, man, that was like actually a really calm and peaceful time in my life. But I was just so like so unsettled, you know. And so I just I had I just had to make a change. It just, it was just, I felt like I was getting old at the beach. And so I took a job with a company in Atlanta and I moved to Atlanta. And in Atlanta, I ended up running this gym, and it was like right in the center of the city. It was full of like, you know, actors and musicians. And so, you know, I ended up my social circle just became different. And I just started partying, I started going out, I got into drugs, you know, and um that just I mean, it just tore my, it just tore my marriage apart right in front of me. And it ended really badly. And I I don't really discuss that. Even in the book, I've redacted those parts because she deserves some anonymity in all in all this, but it ended really badly. And um,
Troubles In Vegas
Speaker 2so what I did was I just got in my car and I drove to Las Vegas. And I'd always had this thing. I always wanted to live in Las Vegas because I used to visit there. You know, they have some of the best bars there. I'm a bartender, they have some of the best fight gyms there as well. And so I just did it on a whim. I just I sold everything I owned and I drove to Las Vegas and I moved into uh a small apartment outside of Fremont Street, and it was like 300 square feet, and I took a job working for a nightclub. Like I was doing a promotions job, and I got myself around, like I'm on the Las Vegas strip, and I'm like, you know, knees deep in the turmoil of Las Vegas, and I'm out till five, six o'clock in the morning with uh some of the people that I met, you know. And next thing you know, I start, I'm I'm like way in partying. I'm I'm you know, I'm out of control, drinking every day. I'm snorting cocaine like all the time. And I end up like ordering some cocaine off the dark web. This is really wild story, but so I uh it turns out not to be cocaine. I overdose on fentanyl. I end up biting my tongue in half, I chip my front tooth. Everybody thinks I got that.
Speaker 1Hold up, slow down, slow down. You're getting really you're getting really juicy now.
Speaker 2Yeah. Um we can stop right here if you want.
Speaker 1No. What possessed you to buy drugs on the dark web? If you want to get your drugs, why not go to a typical dealer?
Speaker 2Well, I thought I could get a better deal. And like, this is kind of a side story, but I was familiar with the dark web when big Bitcoin first came out. Um that's actually there's some stuff in my book about that. But I bought Bitcoin for like two and three bucks back in the day, you know, and I have nothing to show for it. So I I had some experience with how the dark web worked, anyways. I was around guys that were hustling on the strip, and I was like, let me let me get myself into this, you know. And so I was basically trying to get plugged in somehow. And my I had almost no experience with cocaine. I really started using cocaine about two months before I went to Las Vegas. You know, my entire life I pretty much said no to it. You know, I worked in the bars and I always saw the people on cocaine as being people who were like kind of uppity jittery people, but the next thing you know, now I'm doing it. And so, you know, it was just a very irrational decision. And I didn't even know, like, you know, obviously somebody else would have known that this wasn't cocaine. I didn't. And I stayed up all night and I was doing this drug, and I'm walking down the Las Vegas strip and I'm looking, I'm like, you know, the link is, and I'm look looking at the sign, and it just spins out of control. And like I go, I need help. And then it just blacked out. It was like I was like, I felt like I was swimming in these bubbles, it was really weird. And then I wake up, I'm in the in the back of an ambulance, and you know, they're like, You had two tonic clinic seizures, you have a huge gash in your tongue, and so on and so forth. And, you know, I just kept going. You know, I just I didn't stop. Um, I did try to get my life together. I took a job selling timeshare.
Speaker 1How long were you in the hospital for?
Speaker 2I was there for that night. I went out and bought a bottle of whiskey and went home. I sat in my little apartment, cried my eyes out because I knew it was hopeless. You know, I knew I was in a bad spot. Um, but I had no idea how to change, and I was so deep into it, you know, that um there was no desire to really change. I just kind of felt like I was driving myself towards an expected end. Um, but I did. I mean, I that was a part of me. I tried to get my life back together again. I started selling timeshare and I met these wonderful Christian people, and I still follow some of them on social media, and um then COVID happened, you know, and COVID just shut the whole thing down. I I wasn't even following the news. I was like, what's this COVID stuff? And next thing you know, like the entirety of Las Vegas is just abandoned. And I'm like, I have so I had these photos on my phone of walking down the strip, and just the entire strip is vacant with the signs all blacked out. It was just like almost like a horror movie or something. And so um I had to pack it up and I moved to Austin, Texas, uh, to go stay with my dad during COVID. But I was just drinking, you know, I just put in a bottle of vodka or whiskey down at night. And so I go into conflict with them, I get kicked out of that house. So I end up moving to Atlanta. And I used to live in Atlanta, so I went back to my old job. They hired me, and then I get back into the you know, the 2020 election comes around. I'm so full of grievance. I'm so upset about COVID. And I get into all the conspiracy stuff, you know, the the Jeffrey Epstein stuff and the mail-in ballots and everything else. And, you know, I was living outside of Fulton County, which is a very, you know, people talk about that a lot. And, you know, I just took it on myself and I was just posting all this crazy stuff. And I was, you know, I look back and I'm like, a lot of the stuff that I believed, I didn't know it was true. I just believed it, you know. I just I I saw images on, you know, a computer of like, oh, this is this and this is this, and I'm like, I'm putting two and two together, and it, you know, now that I'm in a more sane mindset, I you have to question if uh anything I ever believed was ever real. I don't know. I mean, is it important? You know?
Speaker 1But anyway, so you kind of went you went down these rabbit holes, it sounds like online and it just wasn't good for you, especially with your with your substance abuse. Yeah, yeah. Do you think you were parent Do you think that substance abuse contributed to maybe some paranoia or to some things, some beliefs going down these rabbit holes?
Speaker 2I don't see how I couldn't. You know, I don't I mean I was self-medicating every night. But I think, you know, when I've I've really done my best to study myself and and how I got here, and I think a lot of it had to do with um, you know, I just would I just allowed myself to be so full of bitterness and just anger. And like, you know, anger is directional. You can't you can't hold anger in, it has to release to something.
Speaker 1What were you so angry about?
Speaker 2I was I honestly, now that I look back on it, I was just angry at myself. You know, I was just angry at myself for for tearing my own life down. I'd had had this great martial arts life, I had a great marriage and I was really working towards something, but I just didn't allow myself to be settled or or to even be grateful for what all I everything I'd done at the time. You know, when I came back from Asia, I felt like a failure because I'd lost a bunch of fights, but I'd done all these cool things and I just didn't give myself credit for it. And I think that spilled out into my marriage and it kind of spilled out into everything else I was doing. And and then, you know, the the consequence of that is that everything falls apart around you because you it's not sustainable. And so when everything fell apart, it was just easier to blame the things that fell apart than it was for me to take accountability for it. So I'm, you know, I'm I'm sleeping on the floor of a friend's house. I'm working a job that like I'm doing a sales job for a gym. And um, you know, I'm I'm just really conflicted. I'm drinking insane amounts of alcohol. I wasn't partying like I was in Las Vegas because the access was different, but I was still getting myself into drugs and stuff and going to the wrong places. And um, you know, the election comes around. I'm I'm sitting inside of this apartment, you know, half the half the the uh city is shut down, and I'm like scrolling through all these like COVID conspiracies, and then that kind of spills into the Jeffrey Epstein stuff and you know, a lot of other things, and you know, like the Roth trials and all this crazy stuff. And I like fully convinced myself that there's like this global conspiracy and it's tied to this election, right? And you know, whatever you want to think about that election, but that was my mindset, you know? And so we were all kind of like this like this online community of people, we were all kind of like hoping this thing was gonna go to the courts and the courts were gonna resolve it, and that just didn't happen. And so, you know, it the kind of thing, the thing, the thought process was, well, what happens next, you know? And so President Trump, he posts on his uh social media, he's like, there's gonna be a protest in in DC on January 6th. It will be wild. And I'm like, okay, well, this is my calling, you know, this is what I'm supposed to do. And so I walk into my boss's office and I'm like, I go ask off three days to go to this protest, you know. And I always joke that he probably thought I asked for three days off to go try to over to the government or something, you know. But um, he's like, no, you can't go. And he's like, You're one of my best sales guys. And I'm like, well, I am going. And he goes, Well, if you leave, you're gonna be fired. And I'm like, Well, fire me. You know, this is how committed I was to this thing.
Mr. Gray Goes to Washington
Speaker 2And um, you know, I I go, I I I get on a plane and I go to uh the protest and I go by myself. And I I do get an Airbnb with a mutual friend uh who lived in the area, and um that that takes us up to uh to the the date of January 6th. So I don't know if you want to go a different direction or whatever.
Speaker 1I'd love to hear about you know the events as they pertain to you and your story. Because it because January 6th is a significant event in your life. It altered the trajectory of your life, did it not?
Speaker 2Oh, yeah, I would absolutely say it did. Um so yeah, so you know, I go to the I'll just go through it really quickly. I go to the protest and like it's I remember it's freezing cold. Like it, like my shoes were like wet, I had Converse on, it was like raining a little bit. So my my feet were so cold. And like it takes Trump like an extra hour to get on stage. So we're all kind of restless. And then there was like I mean I literally probably two million, three million people there. It was an enormous crowd.
Speaker 1What's the energy like? Like, what are people saying? What's the general vibe and energy there?
Speaker 2So this is this is kind of contrary to what most people believe, but January 6th was like one of the most jovial and like like celebratory events I've ever been to. Like people were dressed like Uncle Sam and like Lincoln, and like people are playing YMCA on boom boxes, and everybody's kind of handing each other stuff, you know. And I always say this like it's important to remember that the majority of people who went to January 6th did not behave the way that I behaved that day. You know, you're talking about a million people or multiple millions of people, and out of that there were 1,500 arrests. So, you know, we have to give a lot of grace to people too, because you know, just even that name can kind of it brings connotation out with it. But so, anyways, we we you know, Trump talks for like an hour and a half, and it was like honest thing was a little bit underwhelming. I I thought he was gonna bring Biden out in chains or something. Like I really had this delusional idea of what was gonna happen that day. And then he then he tells everybody, he's like, go ahead and march down. He said, like peacefully and pay patriotically, go protest at the Capitol. And so I wait to the end of the speech, and then we all walk down the lawn in Pennsylvania Avenue, and it was like it's about an hour walk to get there, maybe 45 minutes to get from the White House to there. And it was like, you know, high five and hug, and everybody's having a great time. And I get to the Capitol, right? And by the time I've got to the Capitol, there's already 30,000 people at the Capitol, and they're on the steps or on top of the fountain, you know, like um, so I walk up and I'm just standing with this crowd, and we're waiting to hear the results of what's going to happen inside. Like, I don't even understand the process. This is, you know, anyways, I don't really know what's supposed to happen, but I know it's supposed to be important. And so nobody's cell phone works because uh, you know, there's too many people in the same spot or whatever. And so people are like winding up those hand radios and we're listening to those, and it's like quiet as a mouse. Like you can hear a pin drop. And um just like as it was quiet, all of a sudden, like five or six people in the crowd, they all go, Pence betrayed us, and the crowd pops. I mean, that it just like it moves like an ocean, you know? And like I got completely separated from my group. Like, I couldn't find them till later on in the day. And so I see a like a scuffle between the police and the protesters happening at the front of the uh, I guess the protest line. So I'm like, I'm gonna walk up there and I'm gonna take a photo and I'm gonna place it on my Instagram. This is the dumbest thought I've ever had in my entire life. But like, this is how quickly things can escalate, you know? So I walk up, I take my phone out, and I have a cop, they just snatch my phone out of my hand, and then they pepper spray me in the eyes. And so I run backwards, I'm like, I need water, I need water. I clear my eyes out, and I just get overcome with this like just rage. Like it was like, and I write, I write specifically about this in the book that I wrote, but it's like I it's like this overwhelming sense of like life has been incredibly unfair to me. You nothing is working in my life right now. I don't care about anything, and you will not do this to me, you know. And it was just it was just a moment where I just I just I went forward.
Speaker 1But the picture, the picture that you took was what was it of? And where were you? Were you inside the Capitol? Were you No?
Speaker 2I was at the I saw the bottom of the Capitol steps, right? I'm right in front of it, and there's a police line and there's protesters, you know. And I I didn't get to take a picture because my phone was taken out of my hand before I got to take it. But I was hoping to I was my my thought process was I was gonna take a selfie with the cops behind me, and it was gonna be something funny to put on Instagram, but you know, that didn't happen.
Speaker 1So you you never made it inside the Capitol.
Speaker 2Oh no, I went inside the Capitol, yeah.
Speaker 1You did.
Speaker 2Yeah, so I take me through that. So I I put my back to the police, you know, and and there's like pepper spray and there's like club swinging and everything. It was just a wild scene. And I get pushed through the other side of the police, and I look over to my right and I see this guy, and he's like a heavy set guy with a beard, and he's like doing like this, like I'll give you a boost, you know? And so I just ran towards it. You know, I didn't I didn't really have any purpose or direction. I just had no idea what I was doing, but he offered me a boost, you know, and so he boosts me onto the staircase. And when I when I look at the timeline, I was probably on the staircase for about 10 minutes, but it felt like 25 seconds, you know, and we're kind of crushed in. And these police come with shields and they try to push us down off the staircase. And so I duck into a little ball and I end up on the opposite side of them. Then I run up to the top and I'm looking at a police officer, and he shoots a canister of tear gas and it lands right at my feet and it just explodes all over me. And so like I'm just choking on this tear gas, you know, and I'm like, and I look up and I see a staircase, and I look back behind me, and there's like a 20-foot drop, and then there's the staircase that I came from. And so I just instinctively I just run up the staircase and I take a right and I go through this tunnel and I end up at the very front door of the West Terrace entrance, right? And so this, like, if you're into the January 6th stuff, this is a big, like, a big moment because I'm standing at the front door of the West Terrace entrance, I'm arguing with the police. You know, I'm like, you guys just stole my phone and I'm I don't I honestly don't remember what I was like.
Speaker 1Let me ask you, are you high? Are you drunk? No, no, no, no.
Speaker 2Sober's day is long. Yep. Unfortunately, I can't blame it on alcohol or drugs. This is this is just my reactive personality showing through. And so I'm standing at the front door of the of the uh the Capitol, and there's three police officers, and they turn around and they just walk inside and they hold the door open, and I just follow them in. And you know, the video's been viewed probably a billion times. Um, it's it's out there. And uh I walk inside and I see the person who I believe stole my cell phone. And I walk over and I ask for my cell phone back like six times. I'm like, hey, can I get my cell phone back? Can I get my cell phone back? And I'm like doing like this, but I'm being a menace, you know, like I'm not trying to be innocent in this whole thing. I'm with a crowd of protesters, I'm being antagonistic to the police. I just put my back to them and got pushed through them. Like, I'm, you know, I'm definitely being confrontational. I'm screaming things I probably shouldn't scream. Um, and so this crowd surges forward. Um, I turn around, I'm like, I look at the crowd, I go, stop. I turn back around, I see there's a staircase. The officer, I believe, stole my cell phones, is running out the door. And so I kind of just go, okay, well, that's enough. You know, like, and then I'm inside of the rotunda, and this cop he yells, um, it's a it's a felony to be in here. And so I'm like, you know, I snap back to reality. I'm like, oh, this is this isn't just a misdemeanor, this isn't just trespassing, you know. And so I walk out the Capitol building and I walk around DC for about an hour and a half. You know, I had to figure out how to get back to my um apartment. I didn't have my phone. I didn't have I had another phone, but it didn't have like data on it, you know. So the phone that I have was taken. So I it took me forever to remember the address. And I was I walked all the wrong way down the street and I had to walk all the way back. And I get home and I uh managed to log back into my Facebook, and it's just gone crazy, you know. Like, hey, are you okay and all this stuff? And you know, so I just kind of I kind of realized like this is a big deal, this is a big moment. Um, but I just thought it was like a day's worth of news, you know. And so I I the next day I actually go back to the Capitol because like I wanted to see if there was trash everywhere. I had this weird thing that I wanted to see if the people cleaned up after themselves or not.
Speaker 1But why?
Speaker 2Because they did I had this thing where like the Japanese baseball fans are notorious for cleaning their stadium after they leave. And I I think I wanted to believe that the people at the protest were good-hearted people and they didn't leave trash on the lawn. But that's maybe not the whole explanation. I think a part of me wanted to go back and just kind of see the scene again. And um, so I go back and I immediately get swarmed on by like 30 officers. I get handcuffed, um, they question me for like 45 minutes, I just deny everything. Eventually they they let me go. And so I go to the airport to fly back to Jacksonville and I make a four-minute video telling the entire story. You know, I just from start to finish, like I told you, I just and I post it on Instagram, you know. And so by the time that I hit the ground, I'd already been turned into the FBI. And so I go to work the next day, I walk into my job, my job is very left leaning, it's in Atlanta, and nobody will make eye contact with me. I literally went back to work the next day after this. That's that's how absurd this whole thing is. And they're all like, everybody's like looking at the ground, and I'm like, oh. Oh, I've been turned in. This is, you know. So I I hop a car and I drive to Jacksonville. And I ended up homeless and I was sleeping on the shop floor of a friend's job and I was doing some outside work.
Speaker 1Wait, wait, wait, wait. Did you did you get fired? Or wait, what do you mean you weren't?
Speaker 2I just left. I'm sure I was fired. You know. But I'm So you just you just left.
Speaker 1You didn't even stick around to see. You booked it. You hightailed it.
Speaker 2Yeah. Well, the thing is I was planning on leaving Atlanta anyways. I was miserable there. I I I had friends there, but my social support system is in Jacksonville. So I was leaning towards going back to Jacksonville. I was dating a girl who was in Jacksonville at the time too. And um so I I was already halfway out the door. And then when that happened, I was like, this is probably the perfect time to go back to Jacksonville.
Hightailing It
Speaker 1Now you went, okay, so you're back in Jacksonville. This is how long after January 6th?
Speaker 2January 8th.
Speaker 1Wow. Okay. S o, but how did you wound you said you wound up homeless.
Speaker 2So I didn't have a place to go. I was dating this girl. I was staying with her mom, but it just didn't work out. And so I just I ended up moving into a friend's job site. Like I was doing out I don't want to name the business, obviously, but I was doing outside work, you know, like outside in the sun work, and they had a they had an office I could sleep in. So I put a mattress in the office and I slept in the office. And, you know, I was just gonna, my thought process was I'll just save up some money. You know, uh I had a I had a car, the car got repoed, so I needed to get a new car, and I was just gonna build my way back up again. And, you know, I stayed in there for about three months, and then summer hit. I can't, I'm too fair skinned to be outside in Florida in summer. So I took a bartending job with a friend of mine and I moved into a friend's couch, and so I was settling in, had a few thousand bucks saved up, I bought a truck, and I was like, all right, cool, this is gonna be okay. And then on May 17th, I'm driving to the beach and I see police cars behind me, and I assume that they're pulling the car over behind me over. He moves out the way, they get behind me, and then the next thing you know, it's like driver, stop your car, get out the vehicle. And you know, so I'm next thing you know, I got my hands out the window, I'm walking back towards the sound of this guy's voice. I completely think it's mistaken identity. So I'm I'm like, there's they got the wrong guy, there's no way. And they handcuff me and they pick me up, and I see all these FBI agents, and I'm like, yeah, I know exactly what this is.
Speaker 1So you're arrested for January 6th.
Speaker 2Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1How does that unfold? What's what's the next step in that?
Speaker 2So the um I get arrested by the FBI, and like they were actually really cool. Like, people don't like me saying that as a January 6th defendant. I'm supposed to hate the FBI, but those guys were nice to me. Like, they they were not malicious, they didn't try to prod or pry into anything more than they could have, you know, they could have made my life a lot more uncomfortable. Uh I ended up like kind of getting to know them on the ride. We talked about martial arts and stuff. One of them trained at my friend's gym, you know, so it was like, okay. And um, so I go spend a night in Duball County because the the Fed uh building isn't open at that time. And I just I don't know. I have no idea what I'm facing, what I'm in for. You know, I just know I'm in there. And the next morning the FBI comes to pick me up and they give me a sack of like a like a Burger King bag, you know, here's some food. I'm like, cool, I eat that. It's better than the prison food. I go into court and I sit down and they start reading off my charges, and they're like, you're facing 37 and a half years in prison. And I just I started laughing. I just literally, I just couldn't believe it. I was like, there's no way this is real, you know?
Speaker 1And what were the charges?
Speaker 2So I had um the biggest one is I had the obstruction of a uh of Congress or obstruction of an official proceeding. It's the 1512 charge. It becomes important later on in the story, but the Supreme Court ended up taking that charge up. And um had an officer assault charge, and then I had a slew of misdemeanors, just like parading and picketing, remaining in a restricted area, you know. Like generally speaking, in a federal prosecution, they're gonna throw everything against the wall and see what sticks. And so, you know, I had seven misdemeanors and two serious felonies. And um, so I'm like, oh man, I'm never getting out of here. And I look over at my attorney and he goes, You have a $25,000 bond. I'm like, well, I could probably get some money together. And he goes, No, you just have to sign it and you're out of here. I'm like, what are you what are you talking about? He goes, it's a signature bond. You sign this, you get to walk out the door today. So I literally just got arrested by the FBI at gunpoint. They take me into prison or jail. I find out that I'm facing 40, I'm basically 40 years in prison. And then like the FBI comes in, gives me a bag of food, shakes my hand, and tells me to come back in a week. And I just walk out of the prison.
Speaker 1Is that I mean, is that common? I don't know anything about that. Is that common to do?
Speaker 2It can be common, yeah. It can be like, you know, the prosecution has to make a case for the fact that you're a flight risk in order to detain you because you're still innocent until proven guilty, you know. So if they can prove that, like, for example, you have access to a jet or you have a history of running or something like that, then they're gonna they're gonna detain you during while you're awaiting trial. But they had no good cause to say that I was gonna be a flight risk. I'd never committed a crime in my life before this, you know? And so um, you know, they let me go.
An Unlikely Ally
Speaker 2And so I spent three years under indictment. And I spent three years, like, you know, starting from zero, I had a truck and I had a couple hundred bucks in my account. And so I had to get work, I had to find places to live. I became a like a perpetual couch hopper. Um and uh the story gets interesting, and this is a big part of the book I wrote too, is about a year after I was um under indictment, I ended up working with this girl, and she's an African-American, heavily tattooed liberal woman. Um, we're still friends to this day, but like we end up dating, and she's like she's like militantly liberal. Like, if you went on her social media page, you'd be like, why is this woman dating a January 6th defendant? But she like ended up becoming my biggest supporter and she moved me into her house and she like took care of me and she like like I have to give her credit. Like, I would not have gotten through that if she didn't step on my side and really jump in. And so it was absurd, you know. I'm I'm facing this federal indictment. Um, I'm a January 6th defendant, you know. I've I have a have an estrained uh relationship with my family, and the only person that I'm communicating with or you know is really by my side is this like heavily left-leaning person, like militantly left-leaning person.
Speaker 1How did you two like what how did that come about? I know they say opposites attract, but this...
Speaker 2I know it's crazy, yeah.
Speaker 1How did that happen?
Speaker 2Well, she just moved down from Salt Lake City, right? And so she didn't she didn't know anything about me in the media, you know. I was pretty well known in Jacksonville, you know, from the January 6th stuff, but she didn't know anything about it. And so we ended up connecting, and so I took her out on a date, and I took her out on a second date. And on the second date, I said, I need to tell you something. I'm one of the January 6th defendants. And she's like, What do you mean? I'm like, you know, remember when they stormed the Capitol, I'm one of the guys from that. And she like lurches forward and she goes, I was screaming at you on the TV that day. You know, and I'm like, Well, is this a deal breaker? And she's like, honestly, no, it's not, you know. But I don't think she knew what she was getting herself into.
Speaker 1What did she get herself into?
Speaker 2Well, she ended up standing by my side for three years, you know, all the way through my plea agreement, all the way um up until you know my sentencing. And the majority of the time that I was in prison, she was right by my side. Um, we ended up, she ended up leaving me about six weeks before I left prison. And um, you know, that that takes an enormous toll on somebody. It, you know, people in prison that they don't have relationships on the outside, you know, family or anything really. The world moves on. And, you know, that was a tremendous ask on my part, you know, to um the entirety of this relationship needs to be, you know, in the shadow of a federal indictment and this news media attention and and everything else. And you know, I just commend her and I'll I'll always have a high regard for her because you know, who could who could ask somebody to do that, you know? We actually live like four houses down from each other. I we we see each other at different places, and there's a lot of space between us too, but um, there's a lot of mutual respect too, you know. Um I and especially on my end. I mean, I'll never forget that. That was one of the nicest things anybody's ever done for me was was hold me down when I was going through all that. Yeah.
Speaker 1What about your family? What's your family's reaction to this?
Speaker 2So that's that's a big part of my book, too. My mom she actually just got out of a hip surgery today, and she was fantastic, praise God. Um, but she's just like my biggest supporter. She's just a lovely, tough, strong woman who's been through everything and comes out with a smile on her face. And um I didn't talk to her for a long time until I got indicted. And then she started reaching out to me when I was in prison and it actually restored our relationship. And, you know, she's the center of my world now. And um, I just I admire her. She's been through so much tough stuff. And, you know, I'd like to emulate her attitude towards life where you can break your hip and laugh about it, you know, like that's just fantastic. Uh, my father, on the other hand, he took my case pretty personally. Um, he's like a staunch conservative from Texas, and so it kind of became like my son's a January 6th defendant, and they won't do this to him. And then I pled guilty and he looked at me like, How dare you plead guilty to this, Daniel? You're supposed to stand up and fight this thing. And I'm like, Dad, I I'm gonna go to prison for 10 years if I if I fight this thing. You know, I looked at the comparable cases, I knew what I was getting myself into. I had good advice around me, I was very focused on my case. I yeah, I, you know, I had a great result. Um, but pleading guilty for him was like a bridge too far. And so he completely cut ties with me. He stopped talking to me. Um, he didn't reach out to me in prison at all. Um just kind of, you know, and our relationship is still strained to this day because of it.
Speaker 1So even though you have talked since you've gotten out of prison, it's drastically affected your relationship.
Speaker 2Yeah, I it it's been it's been quite a while since I've spoken to my father, unfortunately.
Speaker 1Now, how long were you in prison for?
Speaker 2So I was in prison for nine and a half months. I know that seems kind of underwhelming for everything, but I had a fantastic public defender. Like I had this just a gritty and like very devoted to my case, public defender. When you have a long indictment and you're in communication with somebody, like you're you're gonna like form some type of a bond with them. And she saw my case from my perspective. She's like, wait a minute, some of this stuff doesn't actually add up. I don't think you're actually, I see, I see you're guilty here, but I don't think you're guilty here. I do think they're being a little bit hard on you, and so forth. And so she fought tooth and nail with me. And the prosecution, they gave us a plea agreement. The plea agreement gave us the right to argue about what actually happened at Sensing. We fought for some very small words. Like I got them to change like 10 words in the statement of offense. Basically said that like my hand touched an officer's b officer's baton, and then 15 seconds later they fell down the stairs. So we're arguing about these 15 seconds, you know? And we went into court with a package, you know, and it was like a 36 photo thing, and it was just it was very elaborate. She hired a um like a like a private investigator to like go through all these videos and everything and to prove where I was. And I mean, it was just a fantastic defense from a public defender, you know. They don't get enough credit, by the way. People think that they're not good attorneys. You can get a six-figure robust defense from a public defender if they if they're invested in it. Um, so the prosecution asked for six years. We ended up getting 30 months. The judge took my side on a lot of things. I faced uh the honorable judge Amy Berman Jackson. She's a very like, they would say anti-Trump judge, but I have nothing but esteem for her because she I wrote her a letter and it was like three pages of like regret and remorse and accountability, and this is what happened. These are my you know, history with drugs, this is all the mistakes I've made. And then the the girl I was dating, she wrote a letter to the judge too, and she's like, Look, I'm not a Trump supporter. And you can look at me and see that I probably not a Trump supporter, but this is the man that I believe in, and he's a good man, and I've been living with him. And, you know, you put all that together, and it, you know, the judge was actually moved by it. And she was like, Daniel, I I see that you're a man who has potential. And she actually said a lot of really nice things to me before she sent me to prison, and they they stuck with me, you know. And um, I told her I said I'm gonna do two things. I'm gonna write a book and I'm gonna open a gym when I get out, and that's what I've been working on now.
Speaker 1So while you're in prison, um does the drug use continue or do you get sober?
Speaker 2Oh, I get sober. Like prison was amazing. Like I know that sounds counterintuitive, but I I didn't go to a tough prison. I went to a like a low security prison. So it was like um like a dorm. So you're not locked behind like a door all day long. So you can go outside, you can wear tennis shoes, there's a place to work out. Um, you know, it it just it wasn't that bad, you know. And I'd been under like, you know, it's actually worse waiting to go to prison than it is being in prison because uncertainty is horrible, you know? And so um when I got to prison, I knew that I was gonna be getting out. I got a relatively light sentence. It was gonna be like a year and a half, you know, at the most in actual prison time. And so I got to like kind of put my feet up a little bit and just be like, okay, the pressure's off. So I started working out. Like I was there's there was no drugs to do, but I didn't want to, anyways. You know, there was there was no alcohol. I did I did drink prison hooch twice. I mean, maybe three times. I'll be honest about that.
Speaker 1You know, prison hooch?
Speaker 2Yeah, they they make alcohol out of like uh fruit and they ferment it with like uh sugars and stuff like that. And I don't know the process, but you can there there are things in prison you can get, you know. I had a really cool, like I had a good cellmate, and like you know, he was a good guy to hang out with. And there were a couple nights that maybe we did drink some hooch. But um, but you know, the for overwhelmingly the experience in prison was great. I mean, it was you know, a lot of a lot of time for self-reflection. And before I'd gone in, everybody was like, Daniel, you need to write a book. And I'm like, Well, I don't know how to write a book. What do you mean? And so I sat down with a pen and paper and I just started banging this book out, you know, and I found a starting place for it. And I just started, I just wrote, I went backwards, I told my life story. And then as I'm writing the book, the book coincides with current events. So, you know, like you'll read in the book, I'm writing about the assassination of Tenton Trump. I wrote that like maybe seven hours after it happened. You know, so it's very like almost like a war, it's almost like a war memoir, you know what I mean, where it's like, you know, this is what happened, and this is what's going on, and so on and so forth. But I take about four hours a day and I just sit down with a pen and I just keep working away at this manuscript, you know, and I'm just writing it and writing it. And uh, you know, the election happens. I write all about the election. It was the craziest election, and I had to watch the whole thing from in prison. And of course, you know, Trump's saying he's gonna pardon us, and then, you know, the uh the Democrat side is like these guys don't ever deserve to be pardoned. And it's kind of the crux of the election was a lot of it was January 6th. And so the election happens. I end up throwing a pizza party on the election. I got all these pizzas made and everything, and um, the election happens, and you know, then you know, the woman I was dating, she breaks up with me. And so like my book just drops. Like it goes from like all this high hope and ask like everything's gonna go uh go well to like, oh my goodness. Like, because it was the first time I realized what it was like to be in prison. You know, I'm in there with guys who've done 20 years, and I'm kind of like hop skipping and jumping around. And then like I lose my connection to the outside through the girl I was dating, and I'm like, oh my gosh, this is this is horrible. Like, this is a horrible way to live. And I start looking at, you know, the other the other inmates who've done like 10, 15 years, and like my respect level for them, it just goes through the roof because I'm like, you guys have internalized like some of the hardest suffering a man can go through, like to watch his family just move on without him. And um, that's why the book's called The Men from the Medium. It's about the men who were in the medium prison who came over. It's kind of a like a subplot. But um.
Speaker 1You're still working on this book?
Talk to Text
Speaker 1Speaker 2
So I am I'm getting this book will be published in the next three months, no matter what condition it's in. I'm I'm so done with this thing. Um, but no, I I I am like so. I had to go back and edit it one more time. And there's you know, clarity, redundancy, showing versus telling, a whole bunch of different things that you know a good editor will do. The problem is that if the wrong person edits it, they can take a lot of the guts of the book out because it was written as in prison. And I'm the only person who really understands what I was saying or why I was saying it. So I've taken it upon myself to do one more edit of the book, and I'm on chapter four, and I've had to buy a computer for this. I haven't had a computer the whole time. I've done everything on my phone. You know?
Speaker 1Really?
Speaker 2Yeah, I've I have literally got I've got this thing from uh uh I have it right next to me, but I have it from a paper manuscript to a phone, uh, to a Word document by talk to texting it into my phone.
Speaker 1So once you get out of prison, you were there for nine and a half months, you said, how are you piecing back your life? How are you piecing your life back together?
Speaker 2So it was wild because I I literally watched myself get pardoned on television in the in the pavilion of the prison. And my case manager comes in and she calls me into the office and she's like, Hey Daniel, we got a letter from the administration, you've just been pardoned by the president. And I'm just like bawling, like you got it, like that doesn't happen, you know? And then three hours later, I'm walking out the door. They they signed our paperwork, they brought some guys in to sign our paperwork out, and I I'm walking out the door and I get out of prison and I have nowhere to go. You know, I I was invested in that relationship. I'd expected to be going there. I didn't have any real family support, you know. My I called my dad, asked for help. Hey, can you get help me get a place? He said no. And so I was like, okay, you know, I'm on my own. And so I went and I slept on my friend uh Tim, uh friend Tim's couch, and uh then eventually I moved into a gym and I slept on the floor of a gym for you know a few weeks. A buddy of mine, a good friend, offered me a job with a signing bonus that was enough to get me on my feet. Moved back into the apartment that my friend moved out of. I've been here ever since.
Speaker 1What do you mean you moved into a gym?
Speaker 2I moved into I I moved into a gym. Like a buddy of mine owned a martial arts school, and he said, Hey, if you come work for me, I can give you a place to sleep in here as well. So I got an air mattress and right back to it, you know.
Speaker 1So then take me to where you are now since since that.
Speaker 2So um, you know, I had to like really fight to get some stability first. Uh I had to, you know, had to get a job and I had to uh you know secure a place to live. And eventually those things they came. You know, I had some tough times at first, and eventually I found a place that was was happy to have me. And they don't know much about my past, or I don't think they do, but uh, you know, I don't talk about it. Um but I've been there, I've been at a place for almost a year now. I'm very well received there. It's a job I'm happy to do. You know, it pays the bills. And um, so I finished the book. I had I got out and I had to write, you know, retroactively about you know getting pardoned and everything else and had the relationship ending. So I finished the book. Then I started overthinking it, and I was like, okay, well, I need to find the perfect editor and I need to find the perfect this. And I did a few podcasts, people were interested. And I sent the book to about five or six other people who I trusted, and every single one of them read it in like two days. You know, they're like, I would get messages at like midnight. I'm still reading your book. Oh my goodness. I'm like, what? What do you mean? You know, and these were like, you know, people I know that were academic and you know, people whose opinion I trusted. And so I finally started believing in it. I was like, maybe I wrote a good book or at least a book worth reading. And um, so about five months ago, me and a buddy of mine, we went partnership on a gym. And so I've been building a gym, and I've been building a kickboxing program and a fitness program, I've been working a job, and I've been editing a manuscript, and I've been uh, you know, and all these things are kind of converging at the same time. And that's that kind of takes you to where I am today.
The Calm After the Storm
Speaker 1Do you have any regrets or do you have thoughts where you wish you would have done certain things differently? And I don't just mean anything related to January 6th, but throughout your life, do you look back? What do you think?
Speaker 2I I think the biggest regret in my life is that I look back on my marriage and I wish I would have been been mature enough to know how to end a relationship correctly, you know. And um, because I that's one of my biggest regrets is not not knowing how to, you know, walk away like a gentleman and you know, realize when things are not working, realize when you are the problem. I'd say that's probably the one thing I regret. Outside of everything else, I don't really regret much of it. And I don't say that obnoxiously, it's just that I know that like I had to go through these things to get to the place I'm at now. And if none of that would have happened, I probably would have been, you know, I probably would have just walked into another disastrous situation. And so I look at January 6th as like being the grace of God, you know, because um, like I I feel like I was probably headed to prison anyways. You know, the way I was living, you know, I was very tumultuous, you know, very upset all the time, drugs and alcohol everywhere, bitterness, angeriness, you know, like uh that that's gonna lead to an expected end. And fortunately for me, it was a situation where, you know, I had to face some real consequences, but they were taken away. And um, so I it's it's I will never I can't say I regret it because that's not true, but what I will say is I would never do anything like that. I would never invite anything like that into my life ever again.
Speaker 1Who's Danny Gray in three words?
Speaker 2This is a good question. You got me stuck for a second. Um just a guy. Just a guy.
Speaker 1Your life is still a work in progress, it sounds like. I mean, I think we're all just a work in progress, but it sounds like it's still ongoing, you know.
Speaker 2Yeah, absolutely, you know, and I I own that too, you know. I I'm not a guru. Like I don't I don't have any great wisdom for you. I'm it's better for me to just lay the facts of my life out as they are. And if anybody wants any sort of what my perspective on that is, I'm happy to give it. But I'm not somebody who I'm I don't have answers, you know, and I don't expect people to think I have answers. I I have a a crazy story to tell, and a lot of it is a survival story, and a lot of it is just the grace of God because you know it it could have gone a completely different direction on so many different ways, and now I'm in a place where it's like you know, life is peaceful and it's enjoyable, and I know how to enjoy the small things again, and I've taken that away from myself. So, you know, that's that's how that's what I've got to offer, you know.
Speaker 1It sounds like you're really embracing gratitude.
Speaker 2Yeah, yeah, how could I not? You know, how could I not? You know, I um I I was in prison with guys who were doing 10 times the time that I was doing, and this is in my book too. But like there's a gentleman in my uh that I met, and that he goes by the name Snake in prison, right? And he was arrested under the uh the crime bill, you know, the where the crack cocaine stuff, three strikes your outlaws, you know, and yeah, he was he sold crack, you know, that's what he did. But he got 25 years on his third offense, and it's a non-violent. I'm not making excuses for drug dealers, but when you've been to prison, 25 years is it's an unbelievably long amount of time. And you know, so he's been in for like 19 years, you know, and every day he wakes up and he goes out and he does like 500 push-ups. And I did the math on that, right? He's done like three and a half to four million push-ups since he's been in prison, just every day, knocking him out, right? Goes to church and like, you know, you ask him every day, how are you doing? He goes, I'm blessed, brother. I'm really blessed. I'm like, you know, so one day I was talking to him about his uh his case, and I'm like, man, you know, that's it's it's horrible. And he goes, he looks at me and he goes, Um, but crime was really bad back then. So they had to do what they had to do. And like I was just like blown away. I was like, oh my goodness, like I have nothing to be upset about. If this man can Be at peace with losing a quarter, you know, a quarter century of his life, and his wife and his kids are grown, having grandkids, he has no idea about. Like, like, I don't have any right to be upset, you know what I mean? Like, I don't have any right to be bitter. And I believe God brought these people into my life to really show me something, you know, like, and um, yeah, so I got the kind of grace that the nobody in prison gets, you know, like to get pardoned. Like, I I don't even have a criminal record, you know. So, like, I I I how could I ever look at that as being anything but wonderful, you know?
Call to Action
Speaker 1What are your thoughts on Danny's story? What are your own pivotal moments that reshaped your life in ways you never expected? What are you feeling? Talk to me. If you're enjoying this podcast, click the subscribe button. If you have a similar experience you'd like to share, drop me an email or a DM at Open Hearts Hidden Truths.
